«I don’t care what people I don’t care about think.»
Douglas Murray
Unfortunately, Joe Rogan has left YouTube, but you still find clips of his shows on it. Among them this cut from an interview with Douglas Murray, in which Murray gives his views on telling the truth. The clip starts after he started to make the point, so I’ve included the missing part as transcript (I still had the episode as podcast on my iPhone, which PhoneView allowed me to extract). It begins with Joe Rogan asking him how he deals with being demonized:
«… one of the things I wanna talk to you about, because, I think you’re a very reasonable person with some with some well-educated beliefs. Your thoughts are thought out, you’ve taken these ideas and it’s not like you’re flippantly expressing them. These are things that you’ve worked over in your mind for quite a long time and written them down, expressed them. But I’ve seen horrible things written about you that don’t make any sense at all. And …»
«Sure.»
«… what has that been like for you to see people, because you’re not willing to go along with this collective group think to have these … people have this completely disingenuous description of you, this interpretation of what you’re trying to accomplish, and the fact that you’re not willing to bend the knee. You’re being demonized in a very uncomfortable way.»
«Ahm … the truth is, I don’t feel it, Joe.»
«That’s amazing.»
«I really don’t feel it. I mean, I don’t know why this might be the case, I can suggest some reasons. One is, I don’t care what people I don’t care about think.»
«Hmm.»
«I really … don’t mind if some bot on Twitter is mean about me. It doesn’t bother me. Ah, the New York Times has never taken a love feeling towards me. But I don’t mind. I don’t need the New York Times to love me. I don’t need any of that. And I don’t care. I genuinely don’t care. My own opinion is enough for me and I get my opinions because I think about them, I investigate them, I travel all the time when we are still allowed to travel and speak to people and meet people all around the world, all the time. I’m fascinated by other cultures, I’m fascinated by what we can learn from each other. And I am genuinely not influenced, at all, by dishonest people who make dishonest claims about me. And I have to say, I just had the good fortune in my life as a writer to always say what I think. And sure that means I make mistakes at times, doubtless, everybody does, but I can’t tell you … and particularly your listeners who are wondering about this … it is so much better in your life to tell the truth. However you see it. It is so much better to just say what you see, than to shut up. Of all the regrets we could all have on our deathbeds, I recon one of the biggest is … the regret that you just sidled through life. Kinda hoping people didn’t notice you and you just got by and did everything you were told to do, and just were a good boy … and then you sidle off.»
«Hmm.»
«I think that’s a regretful position to be in. So I’ve always said what I thought, I’ve always written what I’ve thought, I’m amazed I’m still here in some ways, but it’s … I have the …»
Joe Rogan and Douglas Murray on “The Joe Rogan Experience”
Hmm, well-put and yeah, totally agree. Still, fricking hard to do. There’s a reason for the quotation “Tell the truth and run.”
(And yeah, Spotify made Joe Rogan an offer that was hard to refuse, but still, YouTube lost a lot of great interviews. Lesson learned, always download what you want to listen to first! And keep those downloads.)
BTW, the essay by Havel should be the one here: https://www.nonviolent-conflict.org/resource/the-power-of-the-powerless/
